I have an electric scooter and I also wear a high vis vest for safety day and night. I also installed reflective tape on my scooter. Just because one single rider did the wrong thing we should not be quick to condemn the overall idea of electric scooters or electric bikes. I am a recent rider and have found it to an excellent alternative to using my car.
Maybe introducing rules around minimum lighting should be made to make them more visible.
The Brisbane City Council has just agreed to INCREASE the number of hire scooters by 50%. In my humble opinion, this is what a future looking, progressive city looks like! Yes, there are dangerous people and bad habits everywhere but shutting down a whole new industry and form of commuting isnāt the way to deal with those problems. https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/queensland/brisbanes-trial-e-scooter-fleet-awarded-50-per-cent-bump-by-council-20210505-p57p75.html
BAN THEM! I and my blind friend were almost run into by one of these scooters being operated by a totally irresponsible person with absolutely no remorse.
Neither is introducing a new hazard for pedestrians and motor vehicles without adequate protection for those the scooters and riders might injure.
To date the majority of the accidents and injuries involving powered scooters have impacted just the rider. Fortunately.
There remains no implemented solution to ensuring pedestrians have adequate recourse if seriously injured by the user of a powered scooter. The same might be said if due to a bicycle, except bicycles manual and electric are predominantly able to share roadways or nominated bicycle paths. Footpaths are not their regular domain.
With powered scooters having a variety of wheel sizes, all much smaller than a bicycle or motor vehicle, it is understandable governments may not want to risk liability arising from their general use on public roadways. Public footpaths are now scrutinised for the slightest trip hazard which also benefits the smaller wheeled scooters, vs road use. It also puts both pedestrians and scooters in the same space.
Compulsory third party insurance required for motor vehicles does not extend to powered scooter use, or bicycles. Of interest Qld registers mobility scooters. There is an assumption Lime and others are liable for any third party loses through the use of their hired equipment. It would be interesting to know if this is one reason govt has accepted an increase in numbers.
If it appears the discussion is anti scooter, itās about where they should and should not be permitted and under what conditions. We currently have a situation where scooters that substantially exceed the legal power and speed limits can be sold legally in Australia. That is despite there being very few places to use such models legally.
Itās prudent to consider the alternate view points. IE that powered scooters need to be banned until such time as our legislation provides appropriate regulation for their safe use, including third party liability insurance assuming continued used on public āfootā paths.
If there is a choice here, it would appear it is not one scooter users can make unilaterally. For pedestrians the choice is whether to share their traditional legal entitlement to use of a public footpath safely with powered scooters.
Wider paths with line divisions? Scooters should be able to be ridden in bike lanes (IMO) and I think that TPI should be mandatory, likewise protective gear. Iām inclined to think that some kind of licensing should also be considered.
Nearly 1 in 4 Aussie workers are employed as casuals. The pay rates are low. Personal accident and employment insurance is not an affordable option. Any unplanned time off work is unacceptable, whether due to a scooter rider or any other misuse of pedestrian areas. Workers comp is state driven, with limitations on when one is covered.
The alternative is a national or state based schemes to fill the gaps. How that would be fairly funded is one question? Motor vehicle related cover is state based as are the applicable laws.
The outcome of the current provisions in the instance the injured party is living at home and supported by the pension are likely unfair. The injured might loose their independence and be forced into aged care. Circumstances that are often financially less favourable than independent living. The ability to recover any damages from the other party an unknown. Best left to the legal experts, who are likely the only winners on a case by case basis.
The more vulnerable in our community are most likely great users of public transport and footpaths. Itās a concern that electric stand up scooters and similar powered rideables are a hazard that have not been properly addressed.
The laws in Qld regarding electric scooters and skateboards.
And the clown I saw last Sunday afternoon on Mulgrave Road, the main road into Cairns. Median strip. 3 lanes each way. 60km/h zone. Concrete footpaths on both sides of the road. No helmet. No brain.
How did my comment about third party insurance get to be about personal accident etc? If you cant afford tpi you cant afford to have an electric scooter
āThere outta be a lawā, and there are apparently many, sometimes contradictory across the states.
Triple Ouch On the penalty!
Itās a timely reminder, although would a young teenager have been treated the same?
The greatest injustice may be the retailer faces zero consequences. Which raises the broader consumer issue of inappropriate sales practices or product promotion.
Curiosity corner.
As a matter of āNationalā significance, there is no mention of any pending senate enquiry to resolve the differences between the state premiers. Oft likened to āherding catsā.
Even though hey may be legal in Qld, I believe they still have a power limitation and max speed limit.
As they should. I used to watch youtube videos of young men riding these things (and the single wheeled ones) at speeds up to 60mph (yesā¦ mph not kph) and was horrified. Forums discussions in other locations have their praises being sung if they can go 25kph or moreā¦ I think they do need to be able to go a bit faster than mobility scootersā¦. theres the issue of remaining upright at very low speedsā¦ but that speed needs to be curbed. No riding on footpaths, its way too dangerous for pedestriansā¦ helmets should be mandatory as they are for bicycles, āeā or otherwise and they should be able to travel in bike lanes and bike/pedestrian paths which are divided in some way. (Around here the paths are barely wide enough for a person to walk the dog.)
I cant see a time when they will be legal in NSW, but you never know.
Europe is also struggling with similar concerns. Holland and Denmark in particular have a long association with pedal power. Both have restricted or banned the public use of rideable battery powered alternatives.
The Dutch are proposing a framework that categorises all types according to weight, size and purpose. The following table is accessible in the link if it does not display with adequate clarity on your device.
Note the proposals include provision of insurance cover and limit all categories to 25kph.
Victoria is joining the party and finally running trials of e-scooters.
That all looks fair. Hope it works out. Hope NSW will get on board too
Some positives in permitting use on roadways per,
The trial will allow people to hire e-scooters and ride them on bicycle lanes, shared paths and lower speed roads (up to 50km/h) within the participating local government areas.
For pedestrians the interface issues are reduced as general use on footpaths is not included.
Since the trial only permits the use of hired scooters, there is a likelihood some form of personal insurance cover will be in place. In particular providing cover if third parties are injured. There was no specific mention of any insurance in the linked release or extent of cover.
A double ouch to the fines on the list of offences, which also typically apply to bicycle users.
I include motorised bicycle which are motorbikes. Iāve had them do the, same thing fly past me. No real courtesy anymore. Its, a real matter of looking out for everyone who is careless. Bad invention in my opinion
This seems like a top idea and product. I can imagine how far it would get in Australia. Specs are in the article. Conclusions would be canāt ride it on the sidewalk becauseā¦ canāt ride it on the streets becauseā¦ ADRsā¦ insurance ā¦ licensing ā¦ helmets
Electric bikes, skateboards and scooters can work well IF the riders show more consideration for pedestrians AND IF pedestrians also show respect to the riders (along with regular cyclists).
I saw this in action in Tel Aviv in Israel. There were double lanes marked on the pavements that run for kilometres along the beaches for example, individual motorised transport vehicles (not cars or other vehicles) in one and pedestrians in the other. Each respected the space of the other and all appeared aware of their surrounds and other users i.e. looking around before making a move etc). Tel Aviv has a large network of rentals too which unlike the experience of rental bicycles in Sydney were not abandoned at will or inappropriately. Not sure why this worked or how but surely Australia could learn lessons from Israelās experience.
Sadly though I cannot see it happening here in any state. Vehicular drivers are assured of their self-imposed superiority complex which they believe gives them license to disrespect all other highway users but particularly cyclists. Pedestrians also need to accept culpability for their own behaviour whether that is heads buried in mobile devices and totally oblivious to their surrounds whether that be other pedestrians (how many times has someone nearly knocked you over because they are not looking where they are going?) cars or yes cyclists and other users on SHARED pathways.
Sadly Australia has many lessons to learn and understand about the concept of SHARING the environment. And few understand the difference between ārightsā and āprivilegeā! The truth is, we all think we have ārightsā (which are actually privileges - e.g. a driving license) but few accept the responsibilities that come with them.
Maybe they didnāt design the roads firstly and with congestion getting worse. If separate paths for both walkers and cyclists was built would solve the problem. O sse enough stupid people even walking o commonly look out because they will not stop. The, worst are those power cycles which are motorbikes. I never remembered it being like that before people were courteous. At least overseas has better systems unlike in Australia.
