Is the modern car any more reliable that one built before the turn of the century?

Transport
1

So I have a car, built-in 2015, that for a period of time I could not lock- two of the actuators that lock the doors were not working. Even with the key turning option, it would not lock. I had to pay to replace the thing.
I have a 2015 car that can ‘throw codes’ because there is water in the brake light housing.
I had a 2009 car that would display irrelevant faults because I had a blown rear light globe.
I had a 2015 and a 2009 car that’s battery just died- like there, on the spot, on the side of the highway while we had a toilet stop. Because "that’s what they do! ", said the Technician.

I know there are more sensors- for everything in a car these days. But it seems they are making them finicky and ultimately less reliable.

These days I go camping with a backup jump starter!

These days I would never be without a roadside assistance program.

I’m not here to bag a specific car brand, and I know that the modern car is safer, BUT is it more reliable?

4 Likes
2

To answer that we need some relevant statistics over time. Perhaps car enthusiasts would know where to find that kind of thing.

1 Like
3

In my experience, cars and the various components that go into them these days are so more reliable than those from the 20th century.
The problem these days, is if something does fail, the ability to fix it yourself is diminished, and the cost of the parts is exhorbitant.

7 Likes
4

Going from personal experience: my
pre-2000 Ford was a nightmare, ended up with the motor catching fire while I was driving.
My 2000+ Toyota is just a dream, first battery lasted 8 years, second one is still going, never had to call roadside assistance during the 12 years, it’s so reliable I just don’t want to let it go!

4 Likes
5

Maybe the more complex a car becomes, the more like (something expensive) could go wrong. Not every part is 100% fault free, but the percentage that have faults possibly has reduced over time and manufacturing and quality testing has improved.

If a car has more parts, it could be argued that chance of a fault increases. This is counterbalanced by parts having lower probability of a fault.

It is also likely some models have more faults than others, this possibly hasn’t changed over time, but one hopes the car they buy isn’t a fault prone model.

Maybe the Automobile Associations breakdown services would have statistics on number of breakdowns over time. This could be broadly compared with vehicle registrations to see if the breakdown ratio increases or decreases. This might give an indication of long term vehicle reliabilities across all makes and models.

3 Likes
6

It’s an interesting challenge question.

With an open mind.
Whether they are pre or post 1999 autos there are brands and models from both eras noteworthy for being unreliable.

Considering the complexity of vehicles manufactured in over the past two decades, they are remarkably reliable.

There is hard data if one chooses to look for it, as well as lots of opinion. Note that opinion may be just a sample of one, unless it’s a well informed industry resource.

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/2021-us-vehicle-dependability-study-vds

The assumption here is motor vehicles in Australia follow similar trends by manufacturer and usage. Would the Aussie industry, which is now dominated by imports choose to reveal which brands are more reliable? One opinion, albeit with a relevant CV.

There’s a selection of other brand and customer based surveys available per Google. None appear to offer any lament that modern vehicles are less reliable than last century. YMMV! :wink:

P.S.
It’s 34 years since We needed a tow. A sample of one, plus two vehicles made this century with approx 375,000km between them as a point of reference.

3 Likes
7

It used to be a common sight to see vehicles from the 1950’s and 1960’s blowing oil smoke from underneath and/or from the exhaust pipe, especially before PCV valves.

They used to need a regular valve grind, followed by new rings and bearings, followed by a fully reconditioned engine.

The speed of the rust was often faster than the speed of the vehicles.

Nowadays, it is vastly different.

I recently saw a petrol vehicle blowing oil smoke, the first I had seen in decades.

The vehicles now wear out before the engines need internal servicing.

Rust is no longer common in late model vehicles.

With the proliferation of electronics, electrical problems are common but no more frustating than the junk generators, voltage regulators and starter motors in old vehicles.

And if the engines got wet, they would stall and not restart, at least prior to the Valiant Hemi engines with their waterproof electronic ignition systems.

People used to say that you could go to a servo anywhere and get parts for Holdens, and of course, you needed to.

4 Likes
8

I can’t comment on cars, but as a Civil Engineer doing roads, some 30 years ago Qld Main Roads started dropping the wide shoulders as less cars were breaking down and needing to pull off. For a while the roads I built had a thin shoulder strip. Then came the mobile phone and people needing to pull over to talk, and now a wide sealed shoulder is back.

It would be 13 years since I had a flat tyre on my private car, and that was in the garage. It would be about 30 years since I had to be towed - but that was after hitting a Roo. I can’t remember the last time I just broke down (not caused by beast or tempest) and had to pull over. My work car was another story, but then I went some places vehicles didn’t and one week had 5 flat tyres. My guess is that cars are becoming more reliable.

4 Likes
9

The motoring associations will be the best mechanics to ask.

1 Like
10

My most modern car is my Suzuki Ignis (2002 model) and it really has never caused me much grief. I’ve had to have a couple of sensors replaced when it was given to just stopping in the middle of traffic. That was about 6 years ago. The engine sensor light is on and I suppose I should get that fixed but its going to cost a fortune and really, all that happens is that I go through a bit more petrol than normal… but its never been that economical anyway. Battery has been replaced twice, tyres once, brake pads once… and I’m not letting it go until I get my mobility scooter and maybe not even then.

1 Like
11

If you can imagine putting a laptop computer in a frost free fridge and it going through many door opening and closings through the day . Fluctuations in temperature . Changes in humidity etc . That is what goes on in a modern car with all its on board computers . I think the mechanicals are very reliable but the ancillary electrical and computer componentry is the weak link .

A friend of mine purchased a high performance hatch back recently . On the telemetry computer there are over 2000 settings for engine , suspension ,gear change rev settings and exhaust diffuser settings . That does not include the AEB kit etc .

Something goes wrong and sure it is covered by a long warranty. But the warranty does not cover your down time without a vehicle .

2 Likes
12

The engine check light on indicates that the engine management computer has detected something worth logging a warning about. It is obviously nothing serious, as your car would not work.
An OBD2 reader that every service center will have can be plugged in and find out what the warning is, and if something needs fixing, then fix it. Otherwise the reader can just clear the warning and turn the warning light off.

2 Likes
13

A side discussion:

Many warnings are indeed faults that require an action. The engine management system, may adjust temporarily to accomodate the fault. This may result in reduced engine efficiency or performance. There is also a risk in some instances of damaging the catalytic converter/s.

AFAIK an OBD2 reader/adaptor can be used to reset a fault, but only temporarily. If the fault is still present the warning light will reappear. The diagnostics available depend on the sophistication of the connected reader and software. Jaycar, SuperCheap etc sell basic OBD2 readers which use Bluetooth to connect to a smart device.

Depending on …

3 Likes
14

They’re far more reliable. My current car, 5½yrs old has had no repairs, routine servicing. Being a Hybrid, the brakes are likely to outlast the car.

I remember Dad’s first car, a '49 AUSTIN A40 - so not turn of the century.

One good thing (if you didn’t break a wrist using it) was that it had a crank-lever if it had a flat battery. Can’t remember too many other good things - the radio … oh, didn’t have one. The heater … oh, wait, didn’t have one of them either. The wipers were terrible. The indicators - oh, wait, didn’t have them - only trafficator arms, which I recall were bent several times.

But - I well remember it broke 3 axles in the few years he had it. The head had to come off at fairly low mileage for a DECOKE and valve grind. The Tappets (valve clearance adjustment we don’t even think about these days) had to be adjusted every 5000 miles.

MEANWHILE - DAILY - check oil, check and top-up water.

WEEKLY - grease shackle pins and other suspension parts, brake and steering linkages. Check tyre pressures - and they almost certainly needed pumping.

MONTHLY - change engine oil, check gearbox/rear axle oil, lubricate clutch linkages, ADJUST brakes!! Top up brake fluid. Check battery with hygrometer. Lubricate distributor.

AND that’s just the start - 1000mile/5000mile checks and adjustments meant it was an every Saturday job to do at least something. Things like cleaning part of the StarterMotor, top up the shock-absorber fluid, clean the AirCleaner - a filthy job.

It was mostly detailed in the “Owner’s Manual” - apart from a full engine/gearbox pull-down.

Today - almost none of that. Cars almost never boil on the side of the road. We have almost no punctures - unlike back then when it was often. Tyres last much longer. Water leaks - often. The boot filled with dust on a gravel road.

And cars drive so much better.

YES - New cars are far more reliable, as well as safer, HEAPS better to drive.

Pity our roads are so congested.

2 Likes
15

How to take all the ‘fun’ out of motoring. - NOT!

Those were the days?

Bump steer, massive body roll in the corners, understeer, drift on the camber, drift at speed, sway and wild changes in direction in a cross wind or any wind or when being passed by a truck. Effective brakes were optional, except on a wet or dirt road where the directional outcome of heavy application was always uncertain!

Those were the days when we all thought we were the world’s best drivers. One obviously needed to be just to survive.

In respect of the improvements in reliability. Even the better vehicles of the day often failed to proceed. If not due to poor design and manufacture, due to a lack of adequate maintenance and our sub-standard road conditions. It’s worth noting that our last vehicles from the 1990’s were likely close to on par for reliability with those post 2000. A Toyota Camry followed by a Ford EB2 and Ford EL Falcons. 100,000km plus each with zero roadside failures. Now have another Toyota and a Ford.

3 Likes
16

Ahh, yes. The body roll - we had 4 children and Mum&Dad in the tiny car. No belts.

You mention the understeer - I never drove the Austin, but checked a few similar era cars when looking for my first car (an FJ it was) - and was a bit surprised by one, can’t remember which one, it was quite capable of oversteering and understeering at the same time on a wet road - think might have been an early Minor (A30?).

And brakes - you can stand on the brakes today - do that on an old Minor or A40 and it flips a coin as to which one will lock up and try to take the car with it. Never the same corner. Adjust them and never really seemed to help.

Dad’s last car was a '92 CAMRY - was still going strong over 300,000km after he died.

2 Likes
17

Been down that road several times, clearng the codes makes no difference except for a day. I’ll get the sensor replaced at some point but the cost is ridiculous.

1 Like
18

To the original question, maybe slightly, but not significantly from my experience …

It would however be interesting to know what the average repair cost is for significant to major faults is now compared to various snapshots in the past. While possibly less common, I’ve (anecdotally) heard some ‘mortgage the house’ horror stories on costs. One I can relate first hand was replacement of the fresh/recirc vent in a 2012-ish Ford shopping trolley - nearly 2k$ in parts alone, hate to think of the labour as it was done under warranty but it required removal of both front doors and the entire dash plus a regas of the a/c when put back together - 4 days in the shop, first time around, another 3 days to respray the doors when they dropped/scratched (both of) them substantially, but that’s another set of laughs altogether … now some years down the track the a/c doesn’t work at all, but there are assurances that has nothing to do with the previous muppetry :rofl:

5 Likes
19

Ha! I remember filing the points. Grabbing a feeler gauge and adjusting the gap. Spark plugs clogging up.
Oh, and remember when you knew it was running nice and lean when you would look at the exhaust and see that the pipe was nice and white with good old leaded petrol.

3 Likes
20

Downtime- currently without a vehicle, actually, it is one month today.

And warranty schmorranty… two of my breakdowns required a tilt tray and we were on our way to our holiday. No recouping of rental accommodation there.

1 Like