CHOICE membership

Daylight Saving. Friend or foe?


#1

Chickens won’t know when to wake …

Curtains will fade more (or less) …

Skin cancer rates will increase if we don’t have it …

My circadian rhythm will be messed with …

The harvest will be affected …

Power usage times will be impacted …

We get more Vitamin D with daylight saving …

You are more likely to be robbed during daylight saving time …

CHOICE forum works better during daylight saving time (* ok I made that one up :slight_smile: *)

I live in a place where there is no ‘daylight saving’ - and personally I am thankful for that.

My perception is that the majority of people have no real need or want for ‘daylight saving’, but for some reason it persists …

I’d really be interested if you would share your thoughts on daylight saving and how it really, demonstratively benefits you, and/or your community, and/or the state/territory you live in …


#2

I like DS the way it is. Not in Queensland!

You might had the thought that for as long as others accept politicians arbitrarily redefining the time of day, we are also the chickens?

In a practical sense and reality there is one hour less sunlight each day in the northern half of Australia compared to the Deep South. Canberra, Sydney, Melbourne etc.

And the sun in Cairns rises nearly an hour later than Sydney mid summer.

None of this makes much difference.

Neither does daylight saving. Despite having dayblight savings, the six o’clock news on TV is still on at 6, prime time is not an hour later, and no one stays up an extra hour at night?

And if you live in Qld or the NT or most of WA, in summer, do you want the hottest part of the day in the afternoon to last an extra hour? Canberra can’t be much better, but then parliament is air conditioned. One more reason to sit late into the summer evenings, or do a Sco Mo and skip summer sittings all together!

P.s. why not just one National time zone and let’s all do DS together. Where ever you are in Australia it will be the same time. Set the time to the centre of the nation, Alice Springs. What could be fairer, fair go Scott M the PM might also agree!


#3

I personally see no benefits to DS at all, and it causes the ridiculous situation of the latest sunrise of the year being in April, rather than in mid winter.
I’m really looking forward to Sunday, when this time shifting abomination will be over… however the respite will be short lived, since DS lasts more than half the year these days.


#4

If the Southern States persist with daylight saving, then I suggest a change to Qld Awards to allow workers to start an hour earlier, if required. That will solve most of the problems of business being out of kilter with their southern suppliers, parent company etc. This is the loudest complaint I hear, which could be solved with a few Qld staff coming in an hour earlier in case Melbourne wants to call. Dairies don’t have to change milking times, most of the rural areas won’t be affected, schools won’t be putting kids on busses in the hottest hours, less disruption.
Research shows the Daylight Savings change over period causes a spike in accidents due to disrupted sleep.
Do we really need the “extra hour of sunlight” or can we alter our lives to suit the season, without the chaos of time zone changes.


#5

Personally I’m in the same boat. Living in WA we don’t have daylight savings, but I remember the trial period a few years back confused me. I just didn’t understand what I was getting from it, especially since it meant it was still dark when I got up and still light when I went to bed.


#6

Totally agree with those against Daylight saving.
Any savings on the lights being turned on later in the evening is taken up by needing lights early morning, especially spring and autumn. Being in Melbourne I need to turn the heating on too in those months.
If at all, DS should be only for the summer months, when it’s useful for workers to have extra daylight in the evening for family or for leisure time.
Those states which already have plenty of sunshine are wise to refuse getting on DS.


#7

Having daylight saving or not doesn’t really worry me as time is a relative concept

I can see when it can be an advantage in areas further south which have longer twilight, as the change in time to DS may allow one to enjoy more of these twilight hours…for social or recreation pursuits.

In hotter northern climates, the DS could mean an extra hour of the day being at home when the temperatures are hotter.

Are these overriding reasons to why DS should be adopted/not adopted…no.

I find the debates about having or not having DS are side distractions to real problems facing the community, Australia and world at large.

If DS was adopted where it historicallly didn’t exist, or was dropped in areas where it has occurred, I wouldn’t be worried and would get on with my own life.


#8

I suppose how much sense it makes all depends on where geographically you live. We are just north of the eastern most point of 'Straya, and don’t have daylight savings. In summer the sun rises at an obscenely early hour, and sets very early in the evening. Remember that in mid to western Qld, the sun would rise and set about 1hr later than here, and they are in the same time zone.

As the community at large goes by the clock and not by the sun, we are wide awake hours early, and asleep by the time westerners and southerners are having dinner.

To make matters worse, we are very close to the border across which daylight savings dare not cross. So there is a constant state of confusion making appointments as to which clock the place is running on.

Therefore if we were to have daylight savings, it would make more sense to have the zones delineated using longitudinal slices, rather than by state.

Whichever way, there needs to be unity on either implementing it or disbanding it. This current piecemeal anomaly ridden approach isn’t efficient or effective for 'Straya as a whole.


#9

Qld has had 3 trials of daylight saving, the first being in the early 1970’s and all were about as popular as a pork chop in a synagouge.

It would be a very brave and/or foolish State Government which would try it a fourth time.

After the first trial, there was a joke floating around about it.

"Why doesn’t Qld have daylight saving?

Because Joh thinks that the sun shines out of his a… and he isn’t getting up and hour earlier for any b…"

image


#10

Which suggests that what ever the solution, if it involves creating different time zones, the problem will always exist. The principle of NIMBY is universal.

A large portion of the business in each state capital relates to the activities and people in the regions of the state. Perhaps for good reason it is why none of the states (Broken Hill an exception) are divided into time zones.

Broken Hill should be in SA and reasonably Northern NSW in Qld, which could resolve two concerns. I recall a similar discussion on the Choice forums this time last year? Personally I enjoy getting up with the sun and doing stuff before the rest of the world turns on. DS would rob me of that cool first hour of the hot summer day. Blackout curtains are a great solution for a sleep in.

It is worth noting that in the middle of summer Cape Byron is not the eastern most point in Australia - when sun rise is considered. Rotate Australia counter clockwise to see the effect, if you feel the inner nerd aroused. It might actually be Point Hicks just on the edge of Bass Straight, or further South in Tasmania near Port Arthur? The maths is complex however there is a simple tool and resource as follows where you can determine the answers for any place in Australia.

http://www.ga.gov.au/geodesy/astro/sunrise.jsp

Brisbane sunrise is later than Sydney mid summer, not by a massive amount, and the day length is also shorter. Australian Eastern Standard Time corresponds to nominally 150degrees east, a line approx half way between Canberra and Sydney. Brisbane the GC and SSC are approx 153 degrees east, so for more than half the year they are already 12 minutes ahead of the rest of the nation. Even greater in Winter. There is an argument on that basis Qld could benefit by adopting Daylight Saving in Winter and have a longer warm winter evening to enjoy. :wink:

While I personally can’t see the need for making all of Australia adopt DS, a point of concession remains a single time zone for the while nation, (based on the mean average of time difference). Approximately Alice Springs time? That way there will never be an argument about disadvantage across boarders or for business.


#11

Today sunrise in Melbourne was at 7:35 am. Very little time left to enjoy the morning before the bustle of working life begins.


#12

I try to always operate on that time :wink:


#13

umm, they aren’t really ahead at all, the sun merely rises a bit earlier, and sets earlier too.

If you put the whole country on one time zone, then you get some pretty ridiculous sunrise and sunset times!


#14

The only country similar size to Australia which I know does this is China. Time is based on Beijing, and head to western China, the sun rises and sets considerably later.

The locals in the west operate on where the sun is rather than China Central Time.


#15

@gordon I totally agree with sentiment. There are some major impacts on personal outcomes.
However a single national time zone is 100% consistent with the business and neighbourly reasons for not having differences in times between states.

To accept the business argument often raised for one common time you must reject the personal consequences of wide variations in actual sunrise, sunset and daytime temperature effects across the nation or a time zone.

To concede there is no sustainable argument from a business or financial position to have common time, it is easier to accept having different time zones and differences between daylight saving or not.

There remains the administrative argument that should a state Capital operate in a different time zone relative to the rest of the state?

And the personal preferences as to whether you are an early riser and enjoy the cool of the morning, or a night person who loves the outdoors late in the day. The latter is less likely in the north and outback as summer evenings are always boiling hot, insect laden and on the coast tropically dripping.

Is Daylight Saving a Friend or Foe? With extended family in three different time zones across the nation, not for us. For some of the family who seem to forget there are differences, obviously inconvenient when they call on the phone!


#16

A novel idea. Works for me. Also means getting up before the coldest time of the day. (win-win)


#17

The rest of the States already think we are a bit backward anyway.


#18

Well the EU is planning to remove DS from their books, they don’t do things without a great deal of thought (whether good or bad) going into that process. If they don’t want it why would we?.


#19

Novel, yes! :wink:

Original, unfortunately not. January 2017.

Also to suggest Australia is the only nation divided on the need for or benefits of Daylight Saving. It appears to also get rolled out across the ‘really really, really really, I mean really really big pond! :jack_o_lantern:


#20

DST in the middle of winter in Melbourne would mean an actual sunrise when the clock shows 8:30 / 8:35🙁