Maybe not Shonky worthy, but the way of the world now, or at least the market economy.
Our LG MS233 microwave (highly recommended by Choice) shat itself last week - can hear fans & see lights, the wall where the microwaves (used to) come from warms up but nothing in the oven heats.
It’s out of warranty (purchased in 2020 for about $180), so the 2-year warranty has elapsed. However, there’s a 10 yr warranty on the inverter. This was definitely a consideration when we purchased it. With the barriers to repair listed below it’s almost as if they don’t want them to be fixed, but maybe I’m just cynical!
So, I contact LG to find the local repair agent, as I naively thought I’ll get it looked at to see why it’s died.
I took it to the agent, who told me he wasn’t interested & didn’t want to even check it.
Despite the 10 yr inverter warranty (which he said the issue almost certainly was), LG only pay him $55 to do the repair.
He charges $150 just to look.
Now I’m an excellent speller, but despite an HD in stats I’m really rubbish at maths. However, I’m pretty sure those numbers mean that the LG just goes in the skip & I buy a new one.
Before that I’m going to try an email to LG suggesting that under Australian Consumer Law, less than 4 years is a very short & unrealistic lifetime for such an appliance & I should be able to get a replacement.
When it comes to the term ‘inverter’ in Microwave cookers, it is more about the way they deliver the microwaves to heat food, than an actual thing that would have some sort of 10 year warranty.
I would look very closely at the warranty T&Cs to see what is actually covered. I suspect it is just marketing puffery that means nothing in practice.
Assume the following outlines the warranty applicable to the “magnetron”, assuming this is what has failed. “Inverter” is a generic term that describes how the power level of the magnetron and hence microwave energy is controlled. The inverter is also a reference to an electronic circuit independent of the magnetron. If it is the inverter electronic competent board which has failed it is not covered in the additional 8 year Manufacturer’s Warranty.
Refer to my high lighting in red re the LG Manufacturer’s Warranty.
The ACL also provides a statutory warranty which may entitle the consumer to additional remedies. Please refer to the Choice guide. Choice also provides guidance on the reasonable expected lifetime of commonly purchased household goods/appliances. At 4 years of age Choice has a clear recommendation as to whether it is worthwhile replacing or repairing. Microwaves (many are relatively low cost) are more economically replaced than repaired.
My take on that specific warranty is from the info printed on the bottom right of the machine itself stating that there is a 10 year warranty on the inverter.
Thanks for that info Mark.
I understood before taking it to their repair agent that the labour cost wasn’t included.
Even if LG were to come to the party, the repairer wants nothing to do with the job at the current rates he gets reimbursed.
As well, the $150 “just to look” is a strong financial deterrent to repairing it.
Before I took it, I had some vague memory that inspection was $80, but was told “that was before COVID mate”.
The whole purpose of the exercise was to confirm or otherwise the economics of the situation.
I build computers for fun and can fix most low level electronics from radios to robot vacs
I’m not mucking about with a microwave though!
It really annoys me that a relatively cheap module (if that’s the issue) that’s plug & play could be the remedy, whereas now it’s just landfill.
Well since there is power to the device, fan, light, but no actual heating for cooking, then that seems like the magnetron has failed.
Very crafty of LG to confuse the concept of ‘inverter technology’ as the buzzword for microwave cookers, with what an ‘inverter’ actually is. A power controller, usually to convert DC into some form of AC at a regulated frequency and phase.
So that warranty of 10 years for the ‘inverter’ is just meaningless hype. As I suspected.
As it will cost more to even see if the thing can be repaired with a new magnetron than a new microwave cooker will cost, then sadly, best consigned to the recycling center.
Unless one is willing and able to do it oneself. And get the part. Seen LG magnetrons around on a cursory search for under $100.
I interpret the topic as a warranty that has no meaning in practice but is a powerful marketing point, and how LG stands behind it. Not the microwave per se.
If an authorised repairer is unwilling to look at the not so aged microwave because LG only pays $55 and they charge $150 to just have a look and provide an estimate, would a consumer experience the same disinterest if the microwave was only 1 year old and in the base warranty? Or if a case was successfully made to LG under the ACL?
The latter would be an incentive for all problems to be outside the warranty so they could charge their $150. It is also revealing they would have signed to be an authorised repairer at $55 if they were unwilling or simply disinclined to do warranty work for that amount.
As often is the case there is a disparity between legal rights and the application of same where we consumers have to fight. For many the fight is not on because it is cheaper and easier to replace something than go through an often combative process.
I look forward to hearing how LG responds and how many iterations before the microwave gets repaired or LG refuses to assist and @stephench gives up, if he does.
We have a Panasonic which exhibited the same problem/symptoms. After contacting Panasonic, they indicated it could be two issues. A failed control module on the control board or a failed synchronous motor. The cost to replace either through one of their service agents was about the cost of a replacement oven. Panasonic suggest that we to buy a new one. As a spare synchronous motor is relatively cheap to buy, bought one and found after installation it was the problem. The microwave oven worked like new again.
So, it may not be the ‘inverter’. Knowing if it is, only a service agent will be able to establish the fault and pursuing might end up costing more than a new microwave (even if it is the inverter and one has to pay for labour and their own expenses such as time and travel).
It is worth noting Choice indicates a microwave should last around 8-9 years, and it is often cheaper to replace them rather than have them repaired. Cheaper microwave ovens might last less time, along with those which have had a hard working life. Your microwave is around half of its expected life (being 4+ years old).
The consumer guarantees under the ACL may apply, but, the oven being 4+ years old and a relatively cheap one, success is possibly unlikely. LG can easily argue the price point and regular usage, the microwave oven has reached its end of life.
It is a shame that quality and longevity of appliances are no longer what they used to be - resulting in waste and increased impacts on the environment and one’s wallet.
An option to see if a Men’s Shed wants it to see if they can repair it. They might be interested, repair it if it can be repaired and onsell it to raise funds for the shed.
Yes I’ve dogged it.
The LG reply basically reiterated the warranty terms, and that they’d honour it on the say-so of the repairer. It’s not worth the $150 for me to find out for sure (even if I could talk the bloke in to it) or wait without one while the process plays out.
I went back through the Choice review and recommendations and ordered a $99 Kmart one last night.
Well no. The fact that the device has power but delivers no microwaves means something is broken between the AC supply and the magnetron, that could be control circuitry that sets the power level, the inverter that supplies the determined power to the magnetron or the magnetron itself. We cannot conclude it is the magnetron.
The term “inverter” is used in the electronics industry to refer to many things including converting DC to AC, controlling the speed of electric motors or the heat of furnaces or in the case of microwave ovens it controls the power being fed to the magnetron rather than the stop/start duty cycle of older microwaves.
This may well be true but it does not follow from the previous. The inverter is a specific chunk of circuitry that does a specific job, it could in principle be warrantable just as the magnetron may be.
The key question here is if the label on the front about a ten year warranty is misleading not how inverters work.
The LG web site is no help. If you check the warranty for the MS233** series it is simply 2 years parts and labour. The extract that Mark published has been misread, the segment on the 10 year magnetron warranty applies to Lightwave ovens which are a completely different line of combination IR and microwave ovens, that table shows microwave ovens as N/A regarding magnetron replacement.
I have an LG MS4236DB which was reviewed by Choice. On the image published by Choice here the front panel says “Smart inverter magnetron 10 year warranty” Which is quite ambiguous. Is it the inverter, the magnetron or both? What is the nature of this warranty, is it part, labour or both?
On my machine that label says “Smart inverter magnetron 10 year warranty On magnetron (parts only)”. It would seem that LG has been tackled about this before and has started updating their labels. See here and several other complaints about this 10 year warranty. My manual says nothing about the warranty and no separate document was supplied.
My conclusion is that:
The LG policy has been a 10 year warranty on the magnetron for the MS line.
This warranty has been badly presented and explained in a number of ways, in some cases deceptively.
The mention of the inverter in this context is confusing, the inverter could be warranted but isn’t.
Being a parts only warranty a significant cost to the owner will be incurred getting the problem diagnosed and the new part installed assuming it is the magnetron. If it isn’t the magnetron the owner will be out of pocket for the diagnosis, which make the warranty pretty much worthless.
It’ll be interesting to see how the cheapie goes. We bought one of those (Kmart Anko P11034AL-B6) in May 2021 after our elderly GE microwave started to make burning smells all on its own. We took that as notification that after 30+ years of trouble-free service it was ready to retire. CHOICE had recently reviewed microwaves and found the cheap KMart ones worked very well (when new). Some CHOICE member reviewers said theirs were good to begin with, but died after about a year. We decided to get one as a stopgap while we worked out what we really wanted.
More than three years of daily use later, the Anko is still going strong (touch wood).
Probably is. But moot point, since it would cost more to find out definitively than the cost of a brand new device with a brand new all inclusive manufacturer warranty that covers everything.
Part of the issue here is the terminology. Deliberately or not, it is not at all clear what is meant by ‘inverter’ or ‘magnetron’. Both are components or groups of components involved in making the microwaves. I suspect many sellers and manufacturers might say either word to mean the whole microwave power train, that is, the inverter and the magnetron. Possibly they do this in good faith some of the time, which would mean the 10 year warranty is meant to apply to the whole bit that produces microwaves.
As others point out, when the appliance retail price is less than the likely cost of service it means that no-one will repair it. But this is NOT the same as saying that the 10-year warranty is void - it just means that if the specified parts go bust under warranty, the seller should replace the whole unit rather than repair.
Then the crux becomes that the manufacturer is insisting on proof that it is a certain part that failed before replacing the unit. How do you prove it without a tech taking it apart and doing diagnostic tests, at a similar cost to repair?
I suggest that the answer is that LG should determine whether it is the “inverter” that failed simply by the symptoms - if everything works except there’s no microwaves, then the microwave system is faulty, i.e. the actual inverter or the magnetron. If they meant ‘inverter’ to mean the whole microwave system, then they should honour the 10-year warranty in this case, without going to a service person, or by allowing the service person to diagnose just by symptoms for $55.
If LG intended to cover only the actual inverter and not the magnetron then there is no easy solution. I would guess that LG did carefully choose to warranty only the actual inverter module, so that there is no real way of practically honouring that warranty – as in the OP’s situation. And the original advertised warranty is therefore useless. To say the 10-year warranty of a specified part is just ‘marketing’ is too soft, as it would really represent an intentional decision to promise an inclusion (the long warranty) that is not in fact, included.
Not the only brand out there using a similar ploy. Chinese brand ChiQ refrigerators offer a total 10 year warranty on the compressor. Politely usually the last item some experts might suggest is likely to fail. Also labour intensive to replace, noting the 10 year warranty excludes labour etc.
One also needs to read the finer print on the product marketing graphics to see past what is a very eye catching message. Are there others out there with a similar ploy?
Possibly worth another look by Choice if it has become one more marketing claim that fails on two counts. Firstly that the warranty is unlikely to be claimed on given the limited and specific failure/s covered. Secondly because the on costs of claiming the warranty may not deliver a sound financial outcome considering the age or residual value of the item being repaired.
This type of non-warranty warranty as a sales and marketing tool is deserving of a Shonky. Maybe @BrendanMays and the Choice Shonky program could put it up top of the new list for 2025? But since it is pervasive who gets the award if it makes the cut?
We also bought an Anko cheapie after having had a succession of microwaves fail outside of warranty (the last one was a Breville that are normally one of the longer-lived manufactured appliances). No complaints a number of years down the line, also touching wood, but the elephant in the room is the lack of brouhaha over built-in obsolescence. Anecdotally your experience with your elderly GE microwave points to the unassailable fact that it IS possible to manufacture a durable and long-lived appliance but all major manufacturers spend a lot of R&D budget these days on tweaking their designs to deliberately fail just past warranty expiration date.
This is not a naive viewpoint, it is capitalist consumerist culture in its most brutal form, the frustrating aspect of this development is that this was a malaise that plagued cheap, poorly manufactured items in the past but could be mitigated by stumping up a lot more cash to purchase a “quality” brand, that is no longer the case I’m afraid…
I now approach the purchase of a new household appliance with much trepidation as it seems impossible to divine what will be more cost-effective, durable or even useable (especially after reading so many conflicting online review and star ratings). I feel like Peter Finch in the 70s movie Network, “I’m mad as hell and I’m not going to take it anymore!”
Agreed! We reckon GE stopped making that and related models (1983-85 or so) because they lasted too long, which meant they couldn’t sell more of them – and because they didn’t break down, GE couldn’t even make money on repairs! We have rellies who bought a similar model before we got ours, and it lasted at least as long as ours did.
The only thing that ever went bung on ours was that the button on the handle came loose (when it was about 20 years old) because whatever anchored it had cracked. Quick and dirty fix of applying a good strong tape to hold it in place while still allowing it to be pressed (to open the door), and replacing the tape at intervals when it started to look grubby, worked for the rest of its life.
Without comment from me, this is a standard in many economics classes, so here goes: one of the more insidious aspects of planned obsolescence is unrelated to the products.
Assume all products suddenly became reliable, repairable, and long lasting. The volume would go down and factories would close; people would not have jobs unless the economic system and societies changed to support what would be a disruptive change.
While obsolescence seems nothing but bad it is a complex issue on how it affects societies, and how reducing or eliminating it would go and options for mitigating impacts.
One answer is prices go up, and significantly so, with wages doing the same, but capitalism also requires profits to grow ad infinitum. Consider that as a political issue and how it would go for any government.
Check u-tube for a possible fault/repair. The inverter type microwaves work by lowering the constant power to heat, ie, if you heat at 50% the inverter runs constantly at 50% power. Where as the non inverter types switch the power on and off to achieve the 50% heat, with the non inverter micros you will hear the power switching on & off if less than 100% is selected…From my experience the magnetron rarely fails.
