I suspect that there are a number of misconceptions about LED lighting. First up, they are not ‘globes’ or even ‘lamps’, they are electronic devices that emit light, as in “Light Emitting Diode”. So, they are just like any other electronic device that have various components to make them work. One important factor is that they need a clean DC supply called a “driver”. For some this is built in and others it is separate, as I have mentioned in an earlier comment - do NOT use a transformer from a halogen light, they cause al sorts of problems.
I have seen a number of comments about that fact that it is not possible to replace the light emitting component! I suspect few people these days would consider replacing the heating element in an electric kettle, in my apprenticeship decades ago I did do that a lot, but these days no-one would bother, it is easier to buy a new one! With LED’s it is just the same - and yes they can be expensive but so are some kettles.
There is also comment about early failure of LED’s “so they must be no good”. This is no different to any other electrical item, they all have a potential to fail! Sometimes it is just a faulty component, and as has been mentioned, LED’s do not handle high temperature. The cooling fins are there to keep the light cool not because the lamp is hot (as in a halogen lamp)!
As for the life of an LED, how much attention do you pay to the life of your flat screen TV? They do last a long time; it is more likely that one will be replace because to get a better and more technologically advance TV then because it has failed! I predict LED’s will be the same (they are in TV’s as well).
If you do have LED downlights installed in your house get the electrician to install a ‘surface socket - do not do this yourself’. They are a power outlet which allows you to plug the LED fitting into rather than have it hard wired. This will allow you to update your downlights whenever you want without the need for an electrician (so to the electrical contractors out there). It is a simple matter of pulling the downlight out of the ceiling, being careful of the spring clips, unplugging it, then plugging the new one in and putting it back in the ceiling!!
One of the big advances is that LED downlights can be covered by insulation, something that is dangerous and illegal to do with halogen downlights. BUT double check that the downlight does have an ‘insulation rating’, it will say something like “can be covered or abutted with insulation”. So, if you do have insulated rated LED downlights installed, check that your insulation is installed properly.
That is certainly best practice, but I have 28 ‘compatible’ LED’s running on 3 years now. 12 were high end products and 16 Chinese junk. The junk initially had a high failure rate (4) in the first year, replaced by spare high end ones, but the rest continue to work.
The ‘drivers’ include 1 LED driver, a few electronic and a few core transformers.
LED globes have been with us for a few years now, and the prices have come down considerably.
They are marketed as being “energy saving” which indeed they are, but whether or not they are “money saving” is perhaps questionable.
The general claim about their life expectancy is around 50,000 hours run time.
A little bit of simple arithmetic reveals that this equates to around five and a half years run time.
Thus if you are using your LED globe for 8 hours per day, you could be forgiven for assuming you can expect it to last about 6,250 days or 17 years.
It’s been my experience that LED bulbs running for about 6 hours per day give up the ghost after about 2 years, 2.5 years at best.
I have saved electricity - yes.
But whether the electricity saved offsets the cost of the LED globe is perhaps questionable.
Once again it’s time to call the marketing people out on this exaggerated life claim.
Choice has tested LEDs in the past and found that their quality varies, and some brands failed prematurely. It is worth reading:
and (member content):
Our own experience is what Choice found. We have had LED lights which lasted in our previous house for over 10 years, with regular use (such a those in the kitchen/family room which were run 3-6 hours per night, 7 days a week - estimated 10,000-15,000 hours use over the years).
More recently, after moving house, we have found that some LED failed quickly (within 1-2 months and were Bunnings brand Luce Bella), and others, like our past experience, have been trouble free for about 21 months thus far (Crompton, Phillips, Brilliant to name a few). Fortunately Bunnings honoured their obligations under the ACL and provided a refund on the pack of bulbs which failed. Some retailers won’t provide refunds as they can’t be sure the failure resulted from a manufacturing defect or the operating conditions of the bulb (too hot or overvoltage which can both easily damage a LED bulb).
I have moved your post to an existing thread which discusses this very topic.
Perhaps it is time for Choice (@BrendanMays, @ChrisBarnes) to revisit LED lighting’s reliability and life expectancy? What makes this review more important and apposite is the proliferation of non-replaceable LED light bulbs in lamps and light fittings; when the LED dies the whole light fitting will be tossed. This goes against our desire to have the ‘right to repair’, and keeping goods out of landfill ethos.
Our experience suggests there are significant differences in quality between brands. We upgraded to LED lights in 2015. The brand name LED down lights in the most used rooms are still going. We’ve had variable results with individual LED globes. Early failure after less than a few thousand hours from several lesser brands?
It’s also worth considering whether the brands or importers are providing adequate product information to enable an informed choice?
Some bulbs come with a specified maximum operating ambient temperature. Some have clear labelling saying they are not suitable for use in enclosed light fittings, EG Oyster lights.
Specifications for one example branded by Phillips is silent on both. It leaves us free to speculate the 15,000 hrs nominal life is able to be achieved in a fully enclosed ceiling fitting of a typical Aussie home with no air conditioning and ambient temperatures that can reach or exceed 40C on occasion. There is no asterisk against the nominal life rating to suggest otherwise?
The voltage specification of 220-240V could be taken as the safe operating range, but more usually is the nominal system voltage. Australian household voltage has a greater permitted range (216-253V). It can go outside these limits for short intervals of time for various reasons. Significant variations in household voltage that could affect the life of a LED bulb are equally likely to damage or reduce the lifetime of many other mains powered devices.
I recollect that the expensive LED downlights we purchased 6 years ago had data sheets which included more complete specifications. Something derived from the quality, design and testing work by the manufacturer. Would a desktop project that asks the same of each importer or brand reveal which products are better assured?
Quoting:
Some products do have specifications that include the nominal design lifetime. EG.
I have come across this “design life” terminology in association with computer disk drives.
It was expressed in this format:-
MTBF = 500,000 hours. (a typical value, although I saw some quoting 750,000 hours).
Translated, that becomes
“Mean Time Between Failure = 57 - 85 years”
This claim infers that the average disk drive can be expected to run for 57 - 85 years.
When I was in the business of building computers, disk drives that lasted more than about 5 years were few and far between. This led me to question the “MTBF” claims, upon which I was duly informed that the “MTBF” figure is a “design life” and has no relevance to the expected run time in real life situations.
That leaves me wondering if the design life figure is of any value or is it just another marketing ploy?
MTBF seems passe, at least for HDD. In regards to LEDs I have read that sometimes the LED itself may be a 500K+ hours device, but the driving electronics is usually the failure not the LED itself, confusing the issue. The drivers are apparently susceptible to time but more so on/off cycles according to some references. Thus MTBF might have been an appropriate metric for [pick a device] once upon a time, but no longer.
Im not sure what type of lighting is used where i live in an apartment block but bulbs are regularly or were going out before they were changed. I still notice some still go out. I can’t compare them to any other bulbs.
I have an IKEA desk lamp with charging for a mobile. Yesterday, the led bulb blew. However it is a sealed unit and and the bulb cannot be replaced so the only thing to do is to bring the lamp to the electronics recycling centre at Matraville. The replacement lamp can take replacement bulbs, cost $119 last night at IKEA, I mentioned that if I had purchased a $30 desk lamp with the ability to change the bulb then the lamp could last 20 years or more and just need new bulbs from time to time. I left the lamp and my details with customer relations at IKEA and will see if there is any action by them. Crazy that one would need to throw away a relative expensive desk lamp because the bulb has blown.
Your post has been moved to an existing topic (although some what older) that includes similar discussion points.
To note it’s not a new thing that others have observed similar with non replaceable IKEA LED lamps.
Choice in reviews of other products including Range hoods and Ceiling fan lights reports some may have built in non replaceable LED’s or require an electrician and brand specific spare part to replace.
My Mercator sealed unit floor lamp lasted about 6 months. It was replaced under warranty. The second one lasted about 3 months. At my request it was replaced with a conventional bulb model. I will not now buy fittings that cannot be relamped.
