Orginally 4 wheel-drives in Australia, were used mostly by people that lived on farms and consequently got duty reductions on these vehicles, because they were used for the farming industry. To my knowledge this tax deduction compared to normal sedans and traditional station-wagons is still in existence. So 4 Wheel-Drivers get a DISCOUNT on their purchase ???.
Also by the way l visited a takeaway Chicken Shop recently and when l returned to my car, the car parked next to the drivers side, since l went to the shop, had parked over the line on my side and completely BLOCKED me from getting into my normal station wagon a Mazda 6.
Upon his return from the Chicken Shop, l complained and he refused to come around to my side and see how much he had parked on my side and BLOCKED ME, then he just DRIVE OFF !!!.
When I began this topic in 2016-17 I was fed up with the paint and dent damage that my small vehicle was sustaining. Yes 4WD are still the main culprit. Their doors open wider and with further reach, so parking next to one is not on any more.
These days I accept that no one has the will, or goodwill, to look after the vehicle beside them.
If they did, they would do what I do and write to the companies (start with the centre manager, and ask them to forward it on) so that an extra few inches could be added to carparking spaces.
I’m not slamming 4WD owners - I have owned them.
Even small car owners accomplish that magical feat of oblique parking, so that I can barely extract my own small car without touching theirs.
The situation will never change, but what I have learned to do, is what I suggested 4WD owners should be asked to do - and that is park in a designated area, away from the smaller vehicles. This is NOT feasible for them either, bc smarty small cars will begin to use THEIR designated spots, bc they would be a little wider.
Best to just shut up and suck it up, in my case. And always choose the END of the parking row, where I can snuggle up to the extreme side of the parking bay.
So far this year (since April, I have found 7 paint-chips or paint-swaps caused by the doors of other vehicles.
Thanks for all of the suggestions, stories and insights.
I don’t blame the owners of any vehicles for their choices, and accept that we are all human and really do not set out to damage any other vehicle.
This is a grey area and will always be so.
4WDs didn’t cause the damage…but possibly inconsiderate drivers/passengers.
It is very easy to open a door of any vehicle, including a 4WD, and not cause damage to others. Even in tighter car spaces. Those who chose to throw their doors open or allow them to swing out in an unsupervised way are the ones who cause the damage. Such damage can result to other cars from any type of vehicle.
We own a 4WD and a smaller car too. Whenever we get into or out of either in car parks we put our hand over the wider part of the car that could touch the neighbouring vehicle. It means we don’t dent or scratch it. Easy enough to do.
This old topic is becoming more relevant as ‘Yank Tanks’ are proliferating and what was once a large 4WD has evolved into the family runabout and more modestly proportioned but still large (for our roads and parks) SUVs are taking over
At what point do the regulators needs to face the reality that what is being sold is not appropriate because of lane sizes, car park dimensions, and so on. It is apparent a large number of buyers are eager to own them in spite of their practicality or impact on the roads.
It would be funny if not humorous if the roads agencies required them to have escorts per road trains and oversized vehicles but I won’t hold my breath. The freedom to do impractical and self serving things seems enshrined for those with money.
Pass the parcel?
Each state and territory provides guidance on what is permitted in each class of road vehicle. All derived from the same national standard.
Light vehicles including small trucks and busses have been agreed to be any not exceeding 4.5 tonnes. Dimensions permitted are very liberal. EG https://www.nsw.gov.au/sites/default/files/2021-03/vsi-05.pdf
Making changes in class definitions may not make any practical difference, without corresponding changes to local Govt and others parking/road use regulations.
Not new as for public roads there are some restrictions, mostly for larger commercial vehicles. For the average motorist there are but few, most typically restrictions to exclude vehicles towing caravans or advise a public road is recommended for 4WD/high clearance vehicles.
Car parking on private property as is true for nearly all off street parking restrictions are up to the owner to decide. That they can is clearly evident - whether in the fine print on time limits, vehicle heights, types or simply BEV’s while charging only.
Few see fit to draw a new line. Why answered by looking to the preferred private transport choices of those most able to.
This would mean that rigid body trucks are also unsuitable for roads. Australian roads are designed such that all public roads are suitable for truck movements (such as emergency vehicles/fire trucks and for rubbish collection services).
Why should regulators restrict vehicles which can be sold in Australian and meet Australian Design Rules?
It should be up to an individual to determine what vehicle suits their needs. There are many vehicles which are impracticable to many individuals due to their use and own circumstances. This is why it should be up to individuals to chose what vehicles best suit their own needs.
While I wouldn’t ever buy such a vehicle, I can see that there may be a need for such vehicles by some.
They obviously shouldn’t, but you have pointed on the underlying problem.
In the same vein why save energy if one can afford it and the ‘regulations’ allow one to use all they can afford? Why not build up to lot lines and shade other buildings because the rules allow? No need to pursue any of that.
The difference is when they take over the routine school, soccer, and groccery runs, make it difficult to see through or over or between traffic, and the drivers think they are in a 1960s era mini they way they drive them. Too true it is a difficult issue so don’t think an issue but freedom of choice, and others do. If only our roads and car parks were built to US standards I might have a different view myself.
What about the needs of the many?
Emergency vehicles and the local garbage trucks etc are garaged outside our urban streets. They are only used on them when essential. In a similar arrangement there are numerous sites these days, not in the typical urban street where one can store the caravan or boat or …
For every need there is an opportunity.
Not to mention the waste service vehicles avoid arriving in school drop off or pick up times.
So every rigid body truck should be banned as well. This is a highly impractical proposition. Also it is a worrying path that because someone doesn’t like US light trucks, no one else has the opportunity to buy them. I would love a world according to @phb, but realised my own views suits my own needs and not necessarily others.
They buy something else. There are no plans to make US light trucks mandatory for all road users.
And is up to the buyer of such vehicles to consider its use based on their own circumstances.
Not our experience living in Brisbane or Tassie.
Our Brisbane location is always serviced before 6am avoiding impact on the adjoining school and minimising disruption to peak hour traffic. We’re also familiar with other Aussie cities with older inner urban streets dated from horse and cart. Depending on where the vehicles park access by a rigid vehicle is restricted or requires in an emergence use of the footpath. Parking a rigid vehicle in those streets or any wide vehicle including a caravan blocks two way traffic. Same for certain models of cross-dressing 4WD’s
It’s not an argument against importing or ownership of one type of vehicle. It’s for regulating what is responsible ownership and use. Our local councils already impose restrictions on where many classes of vehicles can be parked on street. For school zones larger vehicles that are buses - mini and larger have dedicated parking. In some locations on seperate roadways.
That a possible use of a product is not prohibited, over time the community determines regulation and restriction is often the best solution.
Saw one of those monstrosities recently. A Ram pickup I think.
It was too wide and long to fit into a normal parking spot at my local shopping center, so the driver just parked it across two spots at a 45° angle. And left it there all day.
Your words not mine. As you wrote it is impractical to ban all yet it seems a festering problem that will only get worse over time.
While vehicles have grown neither our older homes nor our older street widths have kept up. In many areas a single Yank Tank could park legally (avoiding the technical issue of essentially blocking the road for the point being made) yet block the road for all but the most mini of vehicles. No worries?
A family member has a 1970s build with a garage suited to a 1970s family car. His choices in the market if he wants a vehicle to fit into his garage so the doors will open have become increasingly limited and getting more so. Back in the days one could fit 2 1960s era Lotus cars in a single car garage but not many drive or want to drive 1960s vintage Lotus these days so many garages are store rooms or getting converted to rooms.
Using that as a blanket life view maybe we should all stop activist posts and allow everyone to sally forth with whatever as they will, unimpeded and guilt free?
These aren’t reason to ban such vehicles. If they were, caravans, boats, trailers, delivery vans, minibuses etc should also be banned as they face exactly the same challenges.
If someone buys a vehicle (too high, too wide, too long, too low) that doesn’t fit their garage, that is their problem and not grounds to ban something because one doesn’t like them.
There are many things I don’t like, but I don’t push to have them banned. If this approach was taken, there wouldn’t be any consumer products because every product would have someone that would like it banned.
I try not to view things in absolutist terms. There are rational limits to what can be supported in and by public spaces. How about if everyone decided they should pick the kids up from school in their Dodge Ram (or large 4WD) trucks with a boat or caravan in tow? Whose problem does that become? Would it even be a problem? Locale dependent. There are approaches and possibly even solutions to most issues should society wish to step up to accept something is a problem.
As I indicated above, these vehicles are not mandated for consumers to purchase. If a consumer decides to purchase a large vehicle, they need to accept its limitations. No differently to any other consumer products.
In relation to your example, it already occurs with tradies driving large 4wd towing trailers dropping or picking their kids up from school. It is assumed any existing vehicles which one might not like or think should be not in a school precinct should also be banned. This means more vehicles in school precinct as school buses would also need banning as they are even larger than the US light trucks.
No they won’t. Parking on footpaths (between road edge and property boundaries as well as restricting road movements by blocking movement corridors is an infringement. We had such issues when living in Brisbane (narrow street) and worked with council to resolve (making only one side open to parking).
Improper parking isn’t grounds for banning a type of vehicle as it is the driver that causes an infringement not the vehicle. Otherwise every vehicle would he banned as they can exceed nominated speed limits.
As I indicated above I used examples to demonstrate issues, not to cite hard inviolate cases.
There is a difference between today’s regulations versus how they could be adjusted to improve societal outcomes. One of the difficult debates is the tension between individual freedoms and rights and the best outcomes for a society and community. I suspect we have moved into that so I’ll step back from this now.
Not exactly about car parks but France is (in a way) addressing the big SUV. The EU area has long since taxed cars on engine size and similar aspects for rego/taxation so this is not new ground, just a twist reacting to modern times.
Story on ABC News which ppl can read by googling it for themselves:
—> Australia’s love of big cars is undoing the benefits of the shift to EVs
This topic has exposed greater issues.
My initial reason for starting this thread, was to try to uncover means to “grade” car parking in supermarket car-parks.
I was tired of inching out of my slot, at risk of hitting traffic leaving or searching for parking, unable to see past the Pajero, Navara etc “bullying me” inadvertantly on left or right.
And tired of getting back to my vehicle only to see someone had “swapped paint” with me via their $#@&%$ door, or with their wide vehicle encroaching on the white line between vehicles, making it near impossible to get in my own driver’s side door!.
I don’t subscribe to the climate change BS and the push to EV’s.
We need gasoline-power, not “green” power - it’s a scam, but just my view - doesn’t have to be anyone else’ view. But we do NOT need “trucks” to drop the kids to school, or to pick up the bread and milk. The cost of running these monsters shines a light on the notion of poverty (or stupidity).
I am still getting updates on the thread - thus this rant.
But I see no solution, because there are a majority of people like me who do not believe in EV’s - and imv they are NOT the solution (what’s the problem?)
Carry on …the ABC story today speaks volumes that I could not. 15th July 2023.
The media is playing catch up?
