CHOICE membership

Thanks For Nothing CBA

We received new MasterCard and Amex cards from CBA yesterday and I made the mistake of activating mine which instantly cancelled the existing cards.
My wife is away visiting our grandchildren in SEQ so I had to rush back out again to send her new cards in Express Post. Fortunately, we both have another Visa card.
All the existing details for the old cards were wiped from Netbank, but whilst I can still access them under Statements for Recently Closed Accounts, all the details which I could view for expenditure breakdowns for various periods and the ability to search for past transactions have gone out the window, both of which I regularly utilise.
When I called CBA yesterday, the first thing the person said was “Congratulations on being a customer for 40 years”. I asked him what they were giving me to which he advised “nothing”.
The letter that the new cards were attached to advised that CBA was cancelling Gold Awards cards and replacing them with Platinum Awards cards at no extra cost, but I do not understand why they need to cancel the old account and start a new account with different card numbers.
Nor do I understand why they even bother to issue new Amex cards when they are cancelling them all by 01.11.2018. They just sent us new Amex cards last month so I have had to update card details with Boost Mobile twice in the space of a month.
:rage::rage::rage:

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Completely understand your frustration. I wonder is this is standard procedure or if they have made an outright error?

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Mine did the same, but I can see the online transaction list and search it - problem is there is a period that is missing in the default search. I did find a workaround to see that period, but another period disappeared. I tried logging a case about it but the person who responded essentially said I could not be seeing what I described on the screen - but of course they weren’t in a position to provide an email address I could forward screenshots to … ultimately I think some of my brain cells actually died having to deal with this person.

Same - I’m sure there is a ‘reason’ that makes sense to them, but in the context of customer service and disruption I think it’s likely they don’t care, so long as their processes comply with some arcane back-end requirements.

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From previous interactions with Westpac who on-referred me to Visa International in response to some questions about card benefits, long since replaced by a Westpac Mastercard as Westpac’s offers changed…

Banks have account numbers binned into the various rewards/customer programs, so if the reward program (eg gold, platinum, black, whatever) changes so does the account group. One might think the program should be a tag against a constant card number but reality is that many of the benefits are managed by Amex, Visa, and Mastercard, not the issuing bank. The companies also have different names and flavours, for example Visa issuers offer traditional, classic, gold, platinum, signature, and infinite cards that differ slightly in different world regions, but map back into Visa defined core cards, each with its set of benefits.

Amex, Visa, and Mastercard are able to use the account number to determine the card class, otherwise they would need direct access to the banking records.

Hope that helps understand…

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My CBA credit was de-laminating (from too much poking as I refuse to do touch and go), so I asked for a replacement. The lovely bank lady who helped me organise the replacement said that CBA was re-issuing many new credit cards with new numbers, and it was possible I might end up with a new card. Luckily this time I got the same account number.

Last time, when there was a potential mass data breach, they cancelled my card and I had to wait two weeks for a new card with a different number to arrive in the mail. In the meantime, there were several direct debits which weren’t paid.

What irks me is that if the bank changes your account number then why don’t they shift all your direct debits over to the new account number? Why is it up to me to contact each of the organisations when the bank could do it with a couple of key strokes?

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I wonder if this is the main reason for issuing cards with new numbers. If a card number has a finite life, so does its value to a criminal trying to on-sell the card numbers.

It will create pain for consumers if it becomes regular practice, especially if one has direct payments linked to a credit card. One will need to review bank statements and notify of companies with automatic direct payment systems of the new card numbers.

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Correct. Vetting our statements got the majority of the direct debits which are monthly, but the semi-annual, and the annual deductions are harder to pick up.

I still think that the bank should be able to do it automatically, or if not provide us with a list of direct debits for each account.

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Would not fraudulent charges then also follow the card?

How does a bank know any particular charge is a recurring debit? All debits show up as charges. If something looks recurring is it an annual debit or something you manually paid at the same time each year as it became due? Regardless, are all still current?

Summary is I see practical problems for the bank to provide an authoritative list. As for myself, I use the American Quicken product which is essentially a ledger system at its core, and it tracks my recurring automated payments for me, and for variable direct debits I put the detail in the memo field that is automatically replicated on each payment, and can thus quickly isolate every payment coming from any source. In the US all the transactions get downloaded from the financial institutions. Here I need to do it all manually :frowning:

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I don’t think so, because the bank (being incredibly clever) would not include any new deductions, only the ones that were there before the fraud or breach.[quote=“TheBBG, post:8, topic:15755”]
How does a bank know any particular charge is a recurring debit?
[/quote]

Good question. I believe that because we have to sign a form which is processed by the bank authorising every direct debit, being responsible corporate citizens, the bank would keep a record of those authorisations. Otherwise under what authority are they deducting money from the account? I would think that if the bank sent me all they had, I could ignore the non-current/cancelled ones.

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Funny one! Well done! :smiley:

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This latest act of CBA stupidity comes on the heels of their claim last month that, after a delay of many weeks, they could not help me recover my payment to Speedyfixer, yet PayPal was able to successfully do so in a matter of a few days.
It also follows another disgraceful incident in 2005 when I was helping my son-in-law to cut down trees at one of their properties when I cut the second last tree and it suddenly turned 180 degrees on its axis and fell on me instead. It struck me on the head, knocked me to the ground and breaking my leg.
After I was released from the hospital, I paid my CBA credit card bill but misread one digit, resulting in underpaying a bill for several thousand dollars by a mere 50 cents.
When the next bill arrived with an interest charge of around $200, I rang the credit card department who flatly refused to waive it.
I then called my local CBA branch, back in the days when you could actually call them directly, and told them I was coming in to close all our accounts and to withdraw a large sum we had on deposit with them.
Shortly after, my phone rang. It was the credit card department who had suddenly discovered that they could actually waive the rip-off but still had the gall to claim if it ever happened again, they would not do so a second time.
Do they actually wonder why people hate the banks, or they just couldn’t care less? Which bank?
They should all be tarred and feathered.

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The form that you sign (on paper or digitally) is held by the direct debit’s payee, not the bank. The payee triggers the monthly withdrawal using that form. The bank doesn’t know it’s a recurring withdrawal.
Fair’s fair. Banks are quite rightly on the nose at present for many valid reasons, but not being able to recognise recurring direct debits isn’t one of them.

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Hi Paul

Interestingly, since I wrote my earlier post, I received our latest cc statement. Much to my surprise, there is now a box at the end entitled “Helping you identify your regular payments”. In this box, is shown the most recent of regular payments we make. They do have a caveat that it may not be a complete list.

Talk about ‘ask and ye shall receive’ ! I knew they could do it :slight_smile:

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I just went through this myself.
I also went through it less than 6 months ago. I had a Platinum MasterCard and the it expired, I asked to have a Gold version - cheaper etc. Because of the change I had to notify a few businesses and charities of my new card details. That is an absolute pain! A couple of weeks later I received a new Platinum Card, complete with Amex card. I took them to the bank and asked them to destroy them. Just recently I received a new Platinum card - and an Amex Card - with a letter stating the Gold card is no longer being offered. And the new Amex card will not be useable in a few months. So, I had to go through the whole process of changing direct debit numbers again! Not Happy! CBA ought to be review its Quality Control procedures.

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Good for them for making the effort. I suspect they’re using software to identify possible recurring entries on your account, which explains the caveat. I wouldn’t mind betting that if they did that on my account they would come up with the guy who looks after my garden, because I send him payments frequently, but not regularly in the sense of this discussion.

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The reasons the banks are hot onto putting everyone on platinum or black is they attract higher merchant fees than the lowly gold or plain ones.

https://www.visa.com.au/about-visa/interchange.html

https://www.mastercard.com.au/en-au/about-mastercard/what-we-do/interchange.html

Amex makes it very difficult to find their merchant fees. I wonder why? (not really) Judging from their marketing they sell ‘lifestyle’ and ‘prestige’ not just ordinary ‘cards’ and try to attract merchants through the vision of cashed up customers who spend more, not just paying customers.

The tables show classes of merchant as well as classes of card.. eg it costs the merchant more to process a premium category card (or Amex) transaction than a standard one that funds the rewards programs and puts more dollars in visa/mastercard/amex bank/system pockets. Who could have guessed it is all about money?

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Just downloaded my last Gold card statement prior to CBA cancelling it.
Apart from checking every entry on a daily basis, as I do with every account, I had not taken much notice of all the other waffle.
I now see that there is a section at the bottom titled “Helping You Identify Your Regular Payments”.
In addition to irregular payments such as airport car parking and the annual home & contents insurance, it also lists our mobile phones which I had already updated and Choice and Ancestry which I had overlooked and will now take care of.
I also again read the info at the bottom of page 1 where it states that if I paid only the minimum payment of $58 on a balance of $2,923.35, it would take 45.25 years to pay off and result in $16,349.34 in interest but if I paid $150.56, it would only take 2 years and result in $690.17 in interest. Being what the banks term a “deadbeat customer”, I always pay the balance in full.
When is the Government actually going to force the banks to increase their minimum payments to a realistic level instead of allowing people to be caught in these debt traps?
Thanks for your tip, meltam 6554.:+1:

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When I visited our local Chemists Warehouse a couple of days ago, I noticed a sign on the counter advising what credit cards they accepted which were Visa, JCB and a couple of strange ones including a Chinese card, with the logos for each beside the names
At the very bottom of the sign below a horizontal was a line stating “We also accept MasterCard” without their logo.
Perhaps Visa supplies these signs.
:-1:

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This will be Alipay which is used widely by the Chinese. I suspect Chemist Warehouse accepts AliPay as it allows mainland Chinese to order direct from Chemist Warehouse and have their purchases shipped directly to China more cheaply, rather than using an intermediary or daigou.

The other major Chinese payment system is UnionPay. But if it was UnionPay, the logo clearly states UnionPay…see the UnionPay link for an example.

I suspect that Mastercard merchant fees may be more than Visa or some other payment options. If they prominently advertise Mastercard and a customer who has both Visa and Mastercards usues ones Mastercard, then it is less profit for the owners of Chemist Warehouse.

Their website provides information on accepted Chemist Warehouse payment methods.

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Yes. It was Alipay and Union Pay.
The sign would definitely be provided by Visa to sponsor their vested interests.
The Chemists Warehouse website lists their accepted payment methods with MasterCard appearing before Visa Card, and definitely not displaying any preference for Visa Card or trying to discourage the use of MasterCard.

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