Photo capture in stores

Two points.
Firstly @phb: thank you for providing the hyperlink above, to their website on reasons for photography. If it is ONLY photography of the eye and/or retina for purposes of their work, then I have NO problem with that. But that is totally different from a whole-of-face photograph, which is what I understood the original posting in here to be talking about.

Secondly: I sent off an email with my concerns about a week ago, but have not yet had any reply from them. Seems like stonewalling to me; which is usually, inferentially, a sign of guilt! (tee hee).

2 Likes

Itā€™s amazing what companies will do to get information about you.Can never be to careful

3 Likes

That is why I have a metaliferous chapeau, so they canā€™t influence my buying habits with radiation.

5 Likes

All the transmitters Iā€™ve installed in shops are in the floor - do you have metaliferous undergarments as well ? :wink:

4 Likes

I hand-delived my letter to the store in Chadstone a few days before the long-weekend, so I expect a response, via snail-mail be received by next Monday. Hopefully, otherwise will follow-up with the link.
Thanks, everyone!

3 Likes

Hmmm??? I wonder if your expectation regarding their timely response has occurred?
(This is asked in jest!).
I have still had NO reply from them.
One would expect it to be so easy and cheap and quick to just send off an email response.
Not so, it would appear.
By not replying to me, they are doing their local franchisee a DIS-service; as I will take my business elsewhere.

2 Likes

These days, my expectations are too high, it seems. Still waitingā€¦

3 Likes

Your jest is near the truth. With the advent of the hoddie to stop you being ID when out in the street, more video cameras are being installed at ground level. This practice of ground level cameras is NOT being acknowledged because there are problems with mini skirts. There is new software out that only activates while the subject is a prescribe distance from the camera and is synced with the overhead security systems. But the software is still new and has not had a big take up yet. These cameras are hard to spot as they are so small, just look at the camera lens on your smart phone, not the camera and surround, the lens can be as small as 2mm.

1 Like

Thatā€™s right the problem with this form of identification is too few mini skirts. Short skirts and shorts should be compulsory, to allow easy identification. We sanction those who wear full-face helmets or balaclavas, it should be the same for those who try to hide their identity behind baggy pants.This is obvious when you see people with boot cameras getting arrested, collecting knees is highly restricted, only ASIO and their ilk are allowed to access such material. But still they try because you can get a lot of money on the black market for a database of knees. If hacked that would be an incredible data breach. Or would it be breech data? If you have done nothing wrong you have nothing to hide! Knees up, knees up donā€™t get the breeze up.

1 Like

This is one of the reasons I never wear mini-skirts ā€¦ another is that Iā€™m a middle aged bloke, not that there would be anything wrong with that of course ā€¦

Getting back to the other end of the body - facial recognition is another thing. I heard tell recently of someone getting their licence renewed having the first photo taken then being told it wasnā€™t acceptable because they smiled and teeth were showing. When asked what the problem was with that, they were told teeth showing stops facial recognition working. I guess the news is that only sad people will be recognised - or criminals will learn to have big smiles because recognition algorithms donā€™t understand teeth ā€¦ the funny and strange stuff you hear from ā€˜expertsā€™ at the vehicle registry ā€¦

It still irks me that someone wearing a facial veil can pay for petrol while wearing it, yet I need to remove my motorcycle helmet, even if its a flip-front style. Someone tried to tell me once that it was different because the veil was worn for cultural/religious reasons - clearly someone whoā€™d never owned a motorcycle :wink:

6 Likes

Iā€™m betting youā€™ve got great legs!

If the problem is cultural, then surely members of bikie gangs would have a clear claim to be permitted to retain their helmets?


Facial recognition is scary technology. I have heard the suggestion that even if you have location services turned off on your phone, a shop could send you ads as you walk past simply by identifying you. There are all sorts of other privacy concerns, so it would be nice to have some legislative clarity about who can take your photo, for what purposes, and how long they can keep it.

I would not say that we should absolutely prohibit taking photos of others - thatā€™s one way that crimes get reported and solved - but we should be very clear about their purpose, use, and lifespan. It doesnā€™t matter whether itā€™s for your driverā€™s licence or an eye test - the use of photos should be clearly circumscribed!

On the bright side, we are not yet like Great Britain - currently the most video-surveilled nation (and yā€™all thought it was China, right?). I also hear that there are ways of applying makeup or other culturally acceptable facial adornments that will fool any current facial recognition technology.

4 Likes

Some of the patterns used in facial recognition are the distance between your two pupils, the shape of the eyes, length of the nose, shape of the face. Then the data can be treated in a couple of ways depending on the system used but they all look for patterns eg Appleā€™s one compares 30,000 different facial points to the pattern stored in the phone to identify the owner.

Some things can be used to confuse the systems but as an example the Apple one can ā€œlearnā€ and recognise the owner even if they have grown a beard, are wearing sunglasses, scarves, hats or similar apparel or facial features that can alter the look of a person.

3 Likes

I agree, unfortunately, with Google spectacles and hidden cameras in hats there really nothing the innocent bystander can do. I will, however, keep corporates on their toes!

3 Likes

I think if I put on some plastic shapes on my chin or cheeks, Apple and others would be confused.

3 Likes

On a similarly concerning issue of biometric tracking, I had to ring the ATO a few days ago. After going through a number of automated processes to prove that I was me (or vice versa), I was offered the opportunity to have my voice print recorded and saved. It would then act as my proof of identity in future.

I considered this offer for about 1/2 a second before responding with an emphatic ā€œNo!ā€. It shows the creeping encroachment of technology on our individual privacy - and in another year or two I wonder if the ATO will even bother to give us the right of refusal.

3 Likes

Re the ATO voice recognition. I thought it was used as one of several items of information necessary to proceed. Your account is not identified solely on a voice print. I took it to be an extra item of security.

3 Likes

Iā€™ve heard there is anti-surveillance clothing, but I have no knowledge on whether it is effective or not. If it is effective, it could also work as a highlighter for unwanted attention.

2 Likes

Maybe there is a market for one of theseā€¦

https://www.photoblocker.com/photoshield-cover-australia.html

to be modified into one of these

then we could patent it and all become rich?

2 Likes

Our gendarmes can ticket for Photoshield type covers if they notice, accepting the chances they would may be small.

All number plates should be:
ā€¦ free from covers, tints or other reflective surfaces that could interfere with plate reading devices

The penalty is $161 in Vic.

There are at least as many curious (as well as questionable) laws and fines attributable to bike riding :frowning:

3 Likes

@postulative : Thank you for this comment.
I thought that I must have been the only person in the entire country who has BIG issues around the ATO and their compulsory voiceprints. That was a few years back, and as a result I have not called them since, so it is good to read from you that it is now an option. I wanted to phone to have certain tax Forms sent to us, and for that purpose ā€“ when they used to make them freely available country-wide ā€“ it was ludicrous and an invasion of privacy IMO to require a voiceprint. My perspective is that anyone should be able to contact every government department easily and freely, and ID should only be required at a point where personal information is NEEDED. cheers all. R.

4 Likes