Tom_2u2 - you make good points. Firstly your stove is lasting a long time. My mother’s induction cooktop doesn’t operate as promised, it cannot handle full output, and it’s out of warranty. It cost $1,600. A problem with many appliances is that they are not designed to last.
A negative on gas though, is that devices that switch off the gas if there is not heat being emitted, such devices are planned to have limited lives. The reason according to my gas plumber, is that authorities want check ups by plumbers to ensure a gas leak is not possible. A major gas leak can kill the household.
On electricity and generation, it’s ironic that in Melbourne, we do not use our gas powered generator except during a heat wave when electric power will cause regular black outs across the city of 5 million. Due to the lack of power capacity. It takes over a day to flush the gas from the un-used line. Using the gas power station would save many tonnes of CO2, because the power station is located in the centre of Melbourne, hence there would be no power line losses, which are around 25%. Secondly the gas burns cleaner than brown coal - another major CO2 saving. But its rarely used, because the “green” electorates around the power station don’t want it operating …
As outlined in a previous post, our older (14 years) stainless steel bench mounted gas cooktop was also in near new condition when we sold the house last year. I suspect that some of the cheaper enamel gas cooktops which can have joins in the cooktop surface can be difficult to clean and keep clean. If I were to buy a gas cooktop again, then I would chose a single panel pressed stainless steel one like yours (and the F&P one we had).
Apart from the health and environmental issues, there is the financial aspect mentioned previously for those on town gas, for which a WA study has been done here:
Just under half of all energy for cooking in Australian homes comes from gas, but a recent report highlights some health risks. We look at options for improving safety:
Tim Forcey wrote an article in 2019 on gas (hint: he prefers electricity/solar etc) and he has a facebook group called My Efficient Electric Home in which if you have the good fortune to have solar and all electric, you’ll find some excellent hints for reducing costs.
and a link to the FB group for those of you on facebook.
Leaking methane from natural gas-burning stove tops is releasing the greenhouse-gas equivalent of hundreds of thousands of cars, and cooking on gas stovetops is posing a risk to health, according to new research.
While methane is emitted while the stove is not in use, nitrous oxides and fine particulate matter (as well as methane) are released during combustion.
They build up quickly in the household while the stoves are on and contribute to respiratory diseases, especially in children and the vulnerable, according to public health physician Dr Kate Charlesworth.
There is little monitoring of fugitive gas emissions in Australia — from the point of extraction, right through the supply chain — and it’s very probable that we’re underestimating our methane emissions as a result, he said.
LPG does not appear in common GHG tables as a high risk gas unlike methane or HFC’s etc. As a source LPG when combusted produces approx 3kg of CO2 per 1kg of LPG.
No. It is a US study of ‘natural gas’ which is primarily methane. There is a move to repeat the study in OZ. Just what that might involve remains to be seen.
I am having trouble getting any hard data about how much methane (natural gas) is reticulated in Oz compared to LPG (propane). AFAIK all bottled gas is LPG. Are you aware of any statistics of the type of gas reticulated domestically?
For example Elgas tells us all about the difference between natural and LPG and that you must be near a pipeline to have it reticulated to your house. It doesn’t tell us where each type is available in Oz or how much is used.
Here we are almost a year later. I have not done anything about getting the stove removed, nor asked Nick to build me a cupboard. I still use the gas occasionally but more often I use my electric appliances (skillet, frypan, microwave oven… and in winter, the slow cooker)… and lately have discovered that I can steam the veg in the microwave easily (including spud which I give a 2 min head start) and any meats in the skillet which doesnt take much room at all. I bought a Kambrook one, and it has a flatt(ish) glass lid which I dont like. I wish I had bought the sunbeam version with a domed lid. I’ll probably get one soon. Makes it more flexible. Electric bill has not increased, but the gas bill has reduced somewhat.
Gross usage refer to various AEMO and AER reports. For reticulated East Coast Gas the AER also uses average household consumption by State or Distribution area in it’s determinations. You may need to do some sums depending on what you need to estimate.
Another resource of energy production and usage are the Commonwealth - sorry they have been long rebranded - Australian Govt energy reports.
The observation re LPG as an alternative to NG. Are users similarly at risk, or is it a lesser concern?
P.S.
NSW and Vic are 90+% of Australia’s residential NG usage. A suspicion is LPG is the more common alternative in the warmer states, and rural areas.
One should be careful in thinking that a foreign study may have implications within Australia. For gas (and electricity), Australia has some of the highest requirements in the world for devices and installations.
One will wait to see if the same concerns found in the US are also in Australia. Until such time, the US study should be used for information purposes only rather than for Australian conditions.
Well yes for the GHG effects from leakage, that is one reason I am interested in how much reticulated gas is LPG (lower GHG effect for leaks) compared with natural gas (higher GHG effect for leaks). Unless we measure leakage we will never know. We could of course adopt the same philosophy as we do for gas fields, pipelines and other infrastructure and not measure fugitive emissions rigorously or systematically.
As for health and GHG effects of combustion products I expect that there would be similar outcomes from methane and propane. But we could just assume there is no problem and not measure that either.
Any consumer can do this if they are concerned, (Gas) plumbers carry equipment to test for leaks. Testing is also required at the time of a new connection to ensure there are no leaks as well, but many consumer would not do their own testing from time to time possibly due to not wanting to pay the expense to do so.
In Australia, LPG/natural gas also has Ethyl Mercaptan added to gas to give it its distinctive odour. The nose is sensitive to this gas and it can be detected at very low concentrations (why it is used).
If anyone smells gas in or around their home it possibly means that they have a gas leak and their pipes/devices should be tested and repaired/replaced as necessary.
