Thank you… I love the “functioning cerebrum” comment… haven’t seen much of that with this company.
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Interesting, on that basis it may be that the installer/s might not have a current licence or even the relevant qual. Tools with tools. This is something else that Fair Trading looks into, at least in NSW, and there’s usually a website you can check.
I still recommend moving swiftly to lodge a complaint, get into the queue and provide further info down the track if you need to but don’t delay.
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Installing split systems requires two licenses. One as an electrician and the second for refrigeration and air conditioning. The licenses are state government issued. Your installer/s for warranty purposes should have provided a copy of their installation report inclusive of the details of their respective licenses. If not, ask for the evidence. In particulate the holder of the license for the air conditioning gas pipe work and who carried out the gassing should be the signatory for that work item x3. Not all electrical contractors have the second license.
I’d hope not to add to your worries.
Hearing this worries me, firstly as to the quality of the original install. Secondly as to the competence of the technician. Perhaps there is a more technical explanation, that was not passed on? New split systems are delivered pre-charged with the correct amount of gas for a standard install. The installation manual will advise the connecting pipe sizes required and maximum lengths before additional refrigerant gas is required. It may be as far as 5-8m depending on the brand, model, etc etc. The average competent refrigeration mechanic is more than capable of checking the size and length of the pipe in an existing installation. Assuming the original installers used a vacuum pump to clear the system of air from the system, and checked the system operating gas pressure, all three should have been left operating (gas added only if the installation manual so instructed).
When following through on the previous consumer advice, it would be prudent to raise concerns the physical installation may not have been carried out correctly. There are a number of (unacceptable) short cuts some unskilled installers might take. If gas was added note it’s use is regulated. The installer should be able to provide a record of the gas type, date and quantity added to your system. There should also be a corresponding record of any excess gas removed and collected. It is illegal to free vent it to atmosphere. It requires a pump and collection cylinder. You may have noticed this at the time?
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Sorry phb, I think what you say is a load of rubbish. $800 for a table refinish doesn’t sound a lot at all, and as Fred 123 says, of course you can expect the whole room to be done. You say yourself that a= single board method may (it will) be a different colour - why should anyone accept that? Answer, they shouldn’t.
Kathy 2 is entitled to full restitution, no doubt.
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Just speaking to a good friend that was a cabinet maker (until April last year) for a furniture restorer in Brisbane, who specialised in undertaking work for retailers who furniture is damaged in transit or on delivery (they are highly reputable and do work for many of the major retailers as well as work for private customers)…the rates when he left to sand and revarnish (three coats which is industry standard) the top of a small table is around $150-200 (coffee table size or 2 seater) to around $400 for a very large table (8 seater). They charge $50 pick and deliver for those items which can be delivered by the customer.
French polishing starts at about double these prices…and can be substantially more if they have to match stain colour or the piece is difficult to French polish. An antique table with engravings where all the French polish is removed and replaced can cost many thousands.
If one looks at online, such as Airtasker, previous rates for all sand and recoating table jobs range from $139 to $550, with a median of $337.
$800 isn’t rubbish and seems expensive for the sanding and revarnishing of top of a hardwood table. My good friend indicated that $800 possibly would be sanding and recoating the whole table (frame and legs) which wouldn’t be needed, unless the rest of the table was in poor condition as a new top would look strange being on a knocked about base. The company shouldn’t be responsible for making the rest of the table like new again…this would be a additional cost borne by the table owner, above and beyond the cost to redo the table top.
Doing the whole floor is like expecting a insurance company to respray a whole car when only on panel is damaged. It won’t happen and is an unreasonable expectation.
As outlined above, a good floor sanding and polishing (coating) company can do a strip repair. This isn’t a patch as the whole of the affected boards from wall to wall are sanded and recoated. The outcome will not be noticeable and significantly cheaper than requesting for the whole floor to be done…not differently to expecting a whole car to be resprayed when one panel is damaged.
@kathy2 is, but only to the damage caused. The above addresses the damage caused by the poor/sloppy work of the contractor who caused the damage and is likely to be considered reasonable should the matter be taken further.
If @kathy2 wishes for the whole of the table to be sanded and recoated to make it look new again…and to sand the whole of the floor in the room to remove any minor scratches or imperfections on the remaining floor, it would be reasonable that the marginal additional cost to extent the work as outlined is paid by @karen2 (just like a car owner that wants the whole of their car resprayed because it is in the shop and would like the whole car resprayed to make it look new again).
Don’t see that it’s like wanting the whole car sprayed at all. In this analogy, The whole car is the whole house - one complete room is one panel.
I agree there MIGHT be other scratches elsewhere on the floor, but that’s just incidental. Repairing the damage properly means the whole floor must be done.
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We did not ask for the whole table to be sanded. Both the aircon company and myself were told you cannot just do that section. And if they know of a company that can & will do it they are not forthcoming. They caused the damage they should be the ones obtaining quotes. Apart from the very obvious deep marks we actually have the the shape of a 9.4KW aircon head unit imprinted on the table. We also have CCTV of them using the table as a work bench, attaching pipes, drilling what we now know to be the metal backing plate and pushing and pulling the unit over the table. They then worked on the metal backing plate on the floors. Dragging ladders around rather than lifting them.I could go on & on… the CCTV tells a very damning story.
There was only 1 tiny mark on my table. It is a hardwood table so not that easy to mark. Your statement sounds like I have a badly damaged table to begin with. And when this goes further and the whole installation is viewed the damage will not be considered reasonable at all.
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Oh yes Mark_m the Installation of the actual units is a whole other story. The pipe runs in this instance are long. 2 of them a bit over 20m, & 1 around 16m. When the “boys” started the installation they started swearing and carrying on because they had picked up supplies for 10mtr runs. The tech guy that came out on Friday told us there is no documentation at all for him to find out the lengths, and that we should ask the company for the details. When we did ask she said the estimates were 10m for the Master bedroom (is actually 20+) 10m for the Living area (is 20) & 16 for the games, which could be right. We had the sales person back here 3 times and we gave him a copy of the plan so there is no way he could legitimately “estimate” those amounts. And how come the smallest run- the games room- has the largest estimate.
The company is now making statements about going to mediation through Domestic Building Dispute Resolution… Not sure how they can mediate over a Consumer issue. This is not a building issue… or am I missing something?
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What state are you in?
NayA we are in Vic
Consumer Affairs Victoria are the best to speak to about this. Ringing them will be quicker than an online inquiry. It is worth having a read through from the menu about problems with products and services.
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We have lodged a claim with VCAT is that the same thing as Consumer Affairs?
No. Different entities altogether.
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Consumer Affairs is not always helpful in a practical sense for a single issue for a single person, but supposedly ‘conciliates’. They have some enforcement power as enumerated in the linked page.
VCAT is a tribunal and generally the last option prior to launching a formal and potentially expensive lawsuit. It has ‘powers’ to adjudicate but no power to enforce its decisions. A VCAT determination sometimes requires the ‘winner’ to apply to a court for an order to enforce the determination, especially if it is monetary and the ‘loser’ does not voluntarily co-operate.
It is not uncommon for VCAT to query what steps one has taken to resolve disputes through the ACL and Consumer Affairs as a step 1.
For people not au fait with their consumer rights and legal process for restitution in these circumstances, they are very helpful. They also then visibility of problem businesses.
I know because even though they couldn’t help me with Doors Plus, they said they are a problem business.
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Coldflow said they contacted the Domestic Building Dispute Resolution. I contacted DBDR to confirm what I suspected… Aircon installation would only come under them if we had gone direct to the tradesman/installer. They directed me to VCAT under Goods & Services. They also suggested I send the CCTV footage of the installation to VCAT but I wasn’t given the option to upload that detail. When we were going through the footage we were gobsmacked to see the extent of the unsafe workplace practices from these installers. One guy climbed the unsecured ladder with the big 9.4KW indoor unit on his own, then used his legs to jolt the ladder closer to wall. Suspect Worksafe would be interested in this footage, along with the trip hazard etc in the roof space.
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It appears you contracted with Coldflow who subcontracted the installation to the offending tradies. If that is the case Coldflow should ‘own’ your problem in the first instance as the prime, shouldn’t they? Or is Coldflow a ‘second company’ you engaged to rectify the installation and that is also advising?
If the former is the case they may be trying to deflect blame by trying to get out of the way and ‘connect’ you to DBDR.
You placed an order with someone/company, and that order should have conditions of contract (T&C) explicitly shown. What does that state about responsible parties?
As I previously posted in another topic.
Our contract is with Coldflow. She tried to pass the buck by referring to the contractor. I “reminded” her that our contract is with Coldflow & their arrangements with their subcontractor is not my problem. Turns out the subcontractor was their Installation manager that decided to become a subcontractor, with his own team. There’s definitely a conflict of interest there…
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